By now, most of you have heard that the Pat Robertson has determined the cause of the recent earthquake in Haiti: it's the result of God's retribution for the nation having made a pact with the devil. In exchange for their freedom from French rule, the devil rules over Haiti. While I have long held Pat Robertson in disdain, he has reached a new height of audacity with this latest stunt. However, I feel there's a more important topic to discuss here than just the meaningless utterances of a failed doomsday prophet

Pacts with the devil date back centuries. While some pacts are for tangible goods, such as the classic Broadway production and film "Damn Yankees," the more insidious form involves human nature's quest for knowledge, with the most famous literary example being Goethe's Faust.  The idea that knowledge is somehow "evil" or to be avoided echoes back from the exploits of Prometheus, bouncing lightly off the Garden of Eden, and resting firmly in the social networks of the 21st century.

Pat Robertson seems convinced that knowledge is a bad thing. Science has shown us that Haiti is in an active seismic area, and superstition is not needed to explain the event. However, WE, the skeptics, have knowledge on how to best handle natural disasters, and that is to spread not superstition, but money. Pat Robertson is an expert at collecting money, and it's a shame he can't just send a portion of his considerable wealth to help undo what he claims his loving God has done.

Forget about Pat Robertson. Let's talk about us for a moment. Skeptics tend to be secularists, and as such, we do not often belong to churches, synagogues or other organizations that organize charity drives. But we do belong to the human race, and it's incumbent upon us to help others when we can. This isn't a religious edict; it's part of our nature. And in this vain, I ask you to visit our good friends at skepchick.org, where a list has been compiled of charities where you can send money that will have a direct impact on people suffering in Haiti.

I know things are difficult these days, but I guarantee you that none of you reading this have it as bad as those in Haiti. Spread some money, spread some knowledge, and may Haiti rebuild itself to be a nation of hope rather than endless tragedy.

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written by ConTester, January 14, 2010

It’s probably been said before, but Robertson is a shameless sicko trumpeting his version of Christian “values” when people are in dire need of help. It is evangelists of his ilk – i.e., ones who cannot even conceive of the possibility that they might be hurtful or just plain wrong – who make the world a worse place for their unshakeable, opportunistic, self-serving religious blatherings. If I believed in divine justice, I would hope that Robertson should become Lucifer’s #1 tormentee.

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Foolishness Knows No Boundaries
written by Realitysage, January 14, 2010

To Stargazer9915:

To disagree with Mr. Robertson with a rational argument is one thing, but to wish that kind of thing on anybody is contrary to the nature of a reasonable mind.

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Feeling rotten
written by OnlyCheryl, January 14, 2010

Being on unemployment (about to run out soon) and very tight budget, I can't afford to give anything. I have given to the agencies in past which are now providing aid. Just wish I could do more. I am keeping a list of those doing the best work and once I get a job, will resume donations. Hope it's soon.

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written by Rustylizard, January 14, 2010

So let's get this straight ... it's the Haitian peoples' fault because they had bad ancestors? The devil is just doing what a devil is supposed to do, and God (as always) comes out blameless for punishing future generations? Most incredible, though, is the enormous number of people who shower Pat with money!

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Fault is linked to DNA
written by xinit, January 14, 2010

Keep in mind, Rustylizard, that both guilt and fault are tied in some way to DNA in the Christianity world view. How else would they explain the concept of Original Sin that keeps them paying for some fruit their distant ancestor shoplifted?

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written by MrIncredible, January 14, 2010

it's a shame he can't just send a portion of his considerable wealth to help undo what he claims his loving God has done

I am not in any way defending what this colossal piece of trash is saying, but to be fair, a number of news organizations are reporting that Robertson is mounting a financial relief effort for Haiti. Seems like the least he can do.

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written by bigjohn756, January 14, 2010

Jeff, the word you wanted is not vain. It took me about ten minutes to determine which word you needed. The word you want is vein. There(their/they're) are too many homophones in English. Vain, vane and vein in this case.

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written by bigjohn756, January 14, 2010

More important than what word to use, I want to donate my money to a charity which will maximize how much gets to Haiti. Somewhere I remember seeing a website which rated charities according to how well they do in this respect, but, now, I can't find it. Anyone know it?

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@BigJohn
written by MrIncredible, January 14, 2010

It's www.charitynavigator.org

If you go to their home page right now there is a link to a list of charities supporting the Haitian relief effort.

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@MrIncredible
written by bigjohn756, January 14, 2010

Thanks, but, I have read several websites which do not rate charitynavigator as reliable. Not very helpful, I know, but, I am still seeking the best way to give some money. I already donated some to the charity recommended by Hemant. Looking for more... I always want to diversify.

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written by MadScientist, January 14, 2010

1. Why do so many people say "Goethe's Faust" when it is Christopher Marlowe who wrote the original Dr. Faustus (I forget the original rather long title) about 200 years before Goethe?

2. "And in this vain" - "vein" I presume?

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written by kenhamer, January 14, 2010

Probably the easiest and safest way to donate it to donate to well known and well regarded agencies. The Red Cross and Doctors Without Borders are two that come to mind.

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written by MadScientist, January 14, 2010

@MrIncredible: "Robertson is mounting a financial relief effort for Haiti."

Ah, he wishes to relieve the Haitians of what little they have? Or is it his flock he is fleecing under the guise of helping the Haitians? I would never give to a religious organization because I've seen how many of them "help" others - it reminds me of George Harrison's "Taxman". It would appear that there is no better way to help others than to help yourself.

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written by MrIncredible, January 14, 2010

MadScientist: We are in COMPLETE agreement. I have no intention of sending dime one to Robertson or any other religious nut. But, since the enemies of science and reason give us innumerable actual reasons to challenge them, we need not make anything up or exaggerate. Jeff’s assertion that Pat’s clan is not sending any money may have been sarcasm, but if I didn’t point it out someone on the other side surely would have to paint us all as liars.

BigJohn: I personally have found Charity Navigator helpful, but to each their own. Happy you found something that works for you!

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Religion + greed = Robertson
written by Kajabla61, January 14, 2010

Never mind that Haiti is overwhelmingly christian - Robertson still blames them for being in cahoots with the devil?

Robertson will almost certainly spend more money on PR than what he actually gives to the Haitians, and then of course he will expect them to become followers and support him by frequenting his church organizations that will be left behind to continue the browbeating...

Pardon me, I've stepped over the line from skeptical to cynical. Religious leaders do that to me.

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@xinit
written by Zoroaster, January 14, 2010

Even if there is one "Christianity worldview" I think it's quite a stretch to say Robertson represents it. Most Christians who focus on the New Testament tend towards helping the suffering and needy rather finding a reason to blame them for their situations. Say what you like about religions and religious people but I bet whatever Skepchick and other secular relief groups get together will be dwarfed by the contributions of the religious community - even if you look at a per person average. Prove me wrong. Please prove me wrong.

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What Haiti really needs
written by Gaius Cornelius, January 14, 2010

Before I contribute I must make sure that my chosen charity has its priorities right.

What Haiti needs right now are lots of bibles, prayer beads, incantations and holy symbols. Charities that insist on providing medical care, rescue equipment, food and building materials will just leave these poor people as lost souls vulnerable to the next disaster. Obviously, the absolute top priority is to build churches as quickly as possible and to renew the faith of the people.

That is of course a parody of religious charity. But religiously based charities - well intended but misguided - will inevitably be expending a proportion of their resources on persuading the populous to believe and behave in particular ways, some of which may not really be in their best interests.

Where I live in the UK, most of the big charities are firmly secular (I make a point of avoiding those that clearly are not, although I may be mistaken in my assumptions). It is worrying to reflect that this may not be the case elsewhere and that the big money raisers are openly religious with all that that implies about their priorities.

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@Gaius Cornelius
written by Zoroaster, January 15, 2010

While your overblown parody does indeed fit some organizations, I reject your assertion that religious charities "will inevitably be expending a proportion of their resources on persuading the populous to believe and behave in particular ways," There is no inevitability here. Human compassion is an amazing thing and it can be organized and implemented in many ways by many organizations. I know from my brother's work in tsunami relief in Sri Lanka and Indonesia and what he has told me about the different NGOs and which of them make the best use of funds. I also know how secular relief groups like Food Not Bombs worked hand in hand with church groups in the New Orleans relief effort. We're talking about Haiti here - do you really think there is any danger they will be introduced to irrational superstitions?

Don't get me wrong, I'm all for giving your donations to a secular relief organization - we need to show that empathy and compassion are universal human traits and not the sole property of theists. And if we compete to see who is truly the most compassionate, everybody wins.

At this point, I say, condemn Robertson and his ilk and all their ignorant hubristic pronouncements but take whatever help you can get for those in need.

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Religious Utterances
written by Slugsie, January 15, 2010

I have heard a few religious types weighing in on the Haitian Disaster, and almost without fail they've managed to come up with something utterly scandalous as a result.

http://www.quietatheist.com/in...arthquake/

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@Zoroaster
written by Gaius Cornelius, January 15, 2010

I can see that I might seem unreasonable as a result of making my point with a parody. Of course, not all the religiously organised (or motivated) charities can be quite as bad as all that. I suppose that it just irritates me to imagine that I personally may have contributed to, for example, bags of food printed with a "Christian Aid" logo - I would rather be sure of sending my assistance via some more obviously secular route. When it comes down to it, if there was no choice I would throw in my lot with a moderate church just for the sake of getting something done.

As you gently imply, if there is any truth to my stereotyped image of Haiti it is unlikely that a little more irrationality will make a great deal of difference. I suppose it is even possible that some moderate irrationality might beneficially displace even more crazy beliefs.

Never mind. What is needed now is practical help and plenty of it.

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written by TDjazz, January 15, 2010

While Pat Robertson's humanitarian efforts, now as well as in the past, are needed, welcome, and helpful, he has an ulterior motive: replace the Haitians' present mumbo-jumbo with his christian mumbo-jumbo. He takes advantage of poor people when they are the most vulnerable.

His statements about the pact with the devil were cruel and totally unnecessary at such a trying time.

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Donate to Red Cross via cell phone text message
written by CasaRojo, January 15, 2010

Text HAITI to 90999 and ten bucks will go to the red cross relief effort. It will charged to you through your cell carrier. ----> http://www.redcross.org/portal...f0870aRCRD

http://american.redcross.org/site/PageNavigator/ntld_nolnav_text2help_faqs

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@TDJazz
written by Slugsie, January 15, 2010

The Haitian population identifies as roughly 80% Catholic and 16% Protestant. Exactly which brand of christian mumbo jumbo doesn't Robertson identify with?

Ref:
https://www.cia.gov/library/publications/the-world-factbook/geos/ha.html

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NOT defending Robertson...
written by Jefoid, January 15, 2010

I was interested to read that the source of the bizarre story related by Robertson regarding the Haitian people gaining freedom from the French through a pact with the devil appears to be an old myth from the island itself rather than one of Robertson's personal delusions. Not that he is excused for bringing it up, but it does make him seem slightly less crazy.

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ABC News has a good story on the source of the Haiti/Pact With Satan legend
written by shawntr, January 15, 2010

http://blogs.abcnews.com/polit...satan.html

I was surprised teh JREF didn't include the story since the skeptic organizations, usually make an attempt to trace the belief. From the above link:
"Robertson’s tale stems from a legend that Jean Jacques Dessalines, who led the Haitian revolution against the French Army, entered into a pact with Satan disguised as a voodoo deity in exchange for a military victory, which finally happened in 1803."
The ABC story has some good links also.

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For what it's worth
written by wallacej14, January 15, 2010

Clearly, posters here will mock and disdain people like PR under almost any circumstances. But he didn't say that God was punishing Haiti. In the context of his own televised fundraiser for earthquake relief for Haiti, he said that Haiti has been under a curse from the Devil for many generations because of "the pact." Again, those here will snort and perhaps say that I'm splitting hairs. But Robertson is not saying (at least in this instance) that his God is punishing anyone. The Skeptical demand for precision must apply in this forum as well as to wooers.

Another point is that PR immediately followed his clearly untestable claim of supernatural activity by insisting that Christians must do all they can to help the impoverished and now shattered country. Christians do many things worthy of disdain, but they give piles of money to causes like this.

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What the? Wallace...
written by Kajabla61, January 15, 2010

According to christinsanity you can't have the devil without god, god is all powerful but he can't stop the devil, BS, BS, and more BS.

Robertson's remarks pretty clearly state that the people have brought this on themselves by working with the devil and/or pissing of the christian god. Either way his remarks are very callous.

Also, christian organizations have been around for centuries and have always raked in far more money than they give back. The people know that prayer doesn't work and they are far more concerned for their fellow human beings than the leaders of their organizations. Robertson, as a crooked millionaire, is a prime example of what is wrong with the self centered SOB's who run these organizations and pay themselves very handsomely for doing it.

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written by Alan3354, January 16, 2010

The "merciful" god will get credit for someone who was buried for days, but survived. He won't get any of the blame for allowing the earthquake to kill 1000s.

That's my prediction.

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written by Alan3354, January 16, 2010

It seems the French are the source of a lot of problems in the world - Vietnam, Haiti, Algeria, etc.

The Mexican holiday, Cinco de Mayo, is a celebration of the defeat of the French there. It's on May 5th this year.

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@G Cornelius
written by Alan3354, January 16, 2010

What Haiti needs right now are lots of bibles, prayer beads, incantations and holy symbols. Charities that insist on providing medical care, rescue equipment, food and building materials will just leave these poor people as lost souls vulnerable to the next disaster. Obviously, the absolute top priority is to build churches as quickly as possible and to renew the faith of the people.


Don't forget "educational software" that Barbara Bush provided (sold) after hurricane Katrina.

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written by Alan3354, January 16, 2010

Is what PR said contrary to what the bible says?

Is it different from the suffering god has caused as told in the bible?

A lot of people avoid thinking of this god that loves us, that also created malaria, polio, and other diseases. I would be much more comfortable in the company of the devil than that of god. How many has Satan killed? How many has God killed?

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written by cosmicbimbo, January 16, 2010

Satan fights back!

http://www.startribune.com/opinion/letters/81595442.html?elr=KArksUUUoDEy3LGDiO7aiU

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written by Alan3354, January 16, 2010

Maybe the pope could sell 1 or 2 jewels from the doorknobs of the vatican.

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@Slugsie
written by TDjazz, January 16, 2010

While the majority of Haitians identify themselves as Christian, "roughly half of the population practices voodoo" (your source) along with their "professed" primary religion. In my opinion, with more than half the population illiterate and voodoo still widespread, the Haitians are ripe for the proselytizing Robertson brings with the aid and supplies.

From another source:
"The figure [2.1 percent] for voodoo represented only those who selected voodoo as their primary religion. A much larger segment of the population practiced voodoo alongside Christianity (most commonly with Catholicism)...."
(Source: http://www.state.gov/g/drl/rls/irf/2006/71464.htm)

I’d venture a guess that while just a few in the country identify their primary religion as voodoo, a portion of the population likely identifies their primary belief as Christian to placate “the elite, conservative Catholics, and Protestants” who frown upon the religion. (Full sentence from my same source: "While the Government officially recognized voodoo as a religion in 2003, it continued to be frowned upon by the elite, conservative Catholics, and Protestants.")

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Some perspective
written by Zoroaster, January 16, 2010

Is there really no common ground here? Does it have to be Christian bad Atheist good all the time? Slugsie, in a situation where tens of thousands of people do not know where their next drink of water will come from, do we really need to worry if the people coming to help might want to add yet another layer of superstition to what is already there?

Once I was injured and ended up in a Catholic hospital, guess what happened. Doctors used modern science to heal me and relieve my pain. Nobody chanted, burned incense, prayed, tried to convert me, or told me God was punishing me. True, if I had needed an abortion I would have been out of luck but I was still glad they were there. Is it so inconceivable that relief workers might be the same way?

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-edit-
written by Zoroaster, January 16, 2010

Sorry I incorrectly addressed that comment to Slugsie. It's more intended for those who engage in generalized religion bashing. It's an if the shoe fits you know who you are kind of rant.

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@Alan3354: 5th of May
written by gfpatterson, January 17, 2010

The Mexican holiday, Cinco de Mayo, is a celebration of the defeat of the French there. It's on May 5th this year.

...and every year.

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Pat Robertson is a certifiable fool...
written by Human Person Jr, January 17, 2010

Pat Robertson is a fool of the first water, and everyone here knows it. He's more deranged than most Christians, and even the most rational Christian is just plain misguided.

Pat Robertson would scoff at the incontrovertible notion that plate tectonics is the culprit.

There is another fool from another religion, however, and that fool has also weighed in on the "cause" (guess what, he didn't say "plate tectonics," either) of the horrific disaster in Haiti.

That religion is CAGW and the fool is celebrated movie actor Danny Glover. He said, and I quote, "“What happened in Haiti could happen to anywhere in the Caribbean because all these island nations are in peril because of global warming. When we see what we did at the climate summit in Copenhagen, this is the response, this is what happens, you know what I’m sayin’?”

So the Earth Goddess Gaia took revenge on the rich, white oilmen by killing residents of Haiti, a place rated by the religious zealots of the church of CAGW as having one of the smallest "carbon footprints" of any country on Earth.

If Gaia was willing to strike out at innocent Haitians for the deeds of others, how does Glover justify his (unstated, but seemingly real) belief in Her?

Yes, Pat Robertson is a cringe-worthy idiot. And, he's not the only idiot weighing in on this disaster. Too bad Mr. Falwell went and died out. No telling how rich his commentary might've been.

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Danny Glover: director, socialist, and opportunist extraordinaire
written by Jonny Zuhalter, January 18, 2010

So what motivates Mr. Glover? Let me put it this way... what's his favorite color? It's red, of course, followed by green.

Like many actors who take themselves and the roles they play too seriously, maybe Mr. Glover's experience on the set of '2012' coupled with his personal and business interests in Haiti (4 year long project of producing a Toussant L'ouveture biography), his penchant for praising socialist dictators and accepting production funds from them (Raul Castro and Hugo Chavez), past history of radical activism, and former public service in government prior to his acting career (City of San Francisco public administration), have all combined to give him a massive near-fatal brain fart when he stupidly suggested that plate tectonics (a sound and tested scientific theory that has consistently held true) and man-made global warming (an untestable and unproven hypothesis that appears less credible with each passing day), are somehow linked.

Mr. Glover most recently starred as the president of the United States in the movie '2012', a ridiculous farce of science in which neutrino bursts from the sun microwave the earth's core, causing "crustal displacement" that creates massive earthquakes, killing billions of people around the world. A movie that combined global warming and plate tectonics... yeah, I think we all understand what inspired him to make his idiotic remark.

Mr. Glover has proven himself, time and again, to be a man desperate to speak and force everyone to listen by any means necessary, like his friends Raul and Hugo. Something in my gut tells me his L'ouveture bio will receive more funding and be greenlit very quickly now that Haiti is in the world's spotlight, and I'm sure he realizes this too.

But I could also be wrong.

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@ Jonny Zuhalter
written by Human Person Jr, January 18, 2010

Thanks very much for the informative comment.

I didn't know all that stuff about the estimable Mr. Glover. The knowledge really helps put his goofy remarks in context.

Thanks again.

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@gfpatterson
written by Alan3354, January 18, 2010

...and every year.

Don't get serious and ruin my joke.

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@Zoroaster
written by Slugsie, January 22, 2010

I know you didn't specifically aim your comment at me, but I figured I'd respond anyway.

Personally I (and probably the Haitians, and anyone else who finds themselves in the middle of a humanitarian disaster) don't care where the aid comes from, as long as it comes.

I do have a problem when the aid comes with strings attached (follow our rules or we take our support away) or when certain 'leaders' try to gain coverage off the back of the disaster, or try to make false claims about the cause in an attempt to make themselves and their beliefs look good. That is exactly what Pat has done, and that is exactly why I find him to be an odious little toad.

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